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- - By vagner [br] Date 2015-08-24 12:24
I and DunkelWipf, we are working in a new object, a magic Staff.
I want opinions about it:
The first question is about the Magic System:
What I did until now: If the clonk have a Magic Staff on the hand and the player do a click on the mouse button, a circle menu will open and the player can select the Spell. If the player click one time more, the clonk will cast the selected spell on direction of mouse point. The next click  will open the circle menu another time and the process will repeat.
What do you think about this magic system?
The second Question is about Clonk's Magic Energy.
I could create a new local variable named "Magic_Energy" on the clonk, and working on this varible, to do a Magic Energy bar for the clonk, But i don't want to change the original clonk script.
I was looking on Objects.ocd in the Hud, and there are the  option to select a magic menu bar.
The question is: The original clonk have a Magic Variable? Can I activate it by functions? Or i will need to change the original clonk script?
Parent - - By Sven2 [us] Date 2015-08-24 14:24
Picturing this, I think it's very slow to use:
* You decide to cast a spell and click (takes 200ms)
* After your first click, you have to find the menu to select the spell first. Since the menu wasn't there before, this creates a very long reaction time (probably around 500ms)
* When the spell has been selected, the menu disappears. Assuming the menu opened near the mouse cursor, it has been blocking the area you wanted to aim to. Therefore, you have to look again where to aim to (probably another 500ms)
-> 1.2 seconds to cast a spell

Compare that to people playing e.g. Floor Fight in Clonk Rage. When they cast a spell there, they just type the spell combo on the keyboard. Typing the combo is only minimally slower than just pressing a key (let's say 250ms). While you press the key combos, you can already place your mouse cursor in the target direction, making aiming practically free (the spell could just be released immediately in the direction of the mouse cursor).
-> 0.25 seconds to cast a spell

As you can see, by the numbers I made up randomly, a keyboard-based spell system is much faster.
Parent - - By vagner [br] Date 2015-08-24 15:15
I think you are right about the time, we need do three click on the mouse for cast the spell: One to open the menu, another for select the spell and the last one to cast it.

I don't know the spell combo system on clonk Rage, i will open the fantasy map to test.
Do you mention something like:
Press Key "X" to open the magic menu and press Key "A or B or C " to select the Spell "A or B or C". After that you can click on the mouse to cast the magic?
or
Something like: Press key "X" to select the magic "1" or Key "Y" to select the magic "2". After that you can click on the mouse to  cast the magic?
Parent - By Zapper [de] Date 2015-08-24 15:34

>I don't know the spell combo system on clonk Rage, i will open the fantasy map to test.


Here is an example video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vxGEx_DS4LY
Parent - - By PeterW [gb] Date 2015-08-24 15:35 Edited 2015-08-24 15:39

>  Since the menu wasn't there before, this creates a very long reaction time (probably around 500ms)


It could appear where your mouse was, which is probably where your focus is anyway. You could then drag-click to select the spell you want - *could* be reasonably fast. As an additional feature, it has lots of potential for hilarious mis-casts under pressure, *and* might cause some serious RSI if people start taking it as seriously as Floor Fight... ;)
Parent - - By vagner [br] Date 2015-08-24 17:51
this is what i did:
http://www.clonkforge.net/projects/project1473/MagicMenu.rar

Give me a reply about the launch magic speed.
Parent - - By Pyrit Date 2015-08-24 19:04
I tried it and it already works surprisingly well imo.
But the click and drag method of PeterW also sounds great.

Pressing down the mouse button creates a target in the landscape (white circle in the middle). Then you drag the cursor in any direction and on release the spell of that direction is cast. The spell will be cast so that it hits the target (white circle)
you set before (blue magic lighting in the picture!). The target should be static in the landscape, so when your clonk and your viewport moves you don't miss your target.

Alternatively, instead of always aiming at the target (white cicle) you could use a second click. But that would mean more moving around with the mouse.

A problem would be that if you have over 9000 spells, the sectors of the selection circle get really narrow.
Parent - - By vagner [br] Date 2015-08-24 19:49
Let me see if i understand:
The first click will set the spell direction and open the magic menu. The second click will select the magic and cast it on the first position?

"A problem would be that if you have over 9000 spells, the sectors of the selection circle get really narrow"
The solution for this problem is do a Magic Staff with no more than six spells?
Maybe one magic Staff on right hand and another in the left hand (12 Spells)?
For more magic you can carry six magic staff and change it on hot key?
Parent - - By Pyrit Date 2015-08-24 20:24

>The first click will set the spell direction and open the magic menu. The second click will select the magic and cast it on the first position?


Almost. Just pressing down sets the target and opens the magic menu. Releasing the mouse button casts the spell onto the target. So only one klick.
Parent - - By vagner [br] Date 2015-08-24 22:32 Edited 2015-08-25 00:04
The problem is: The circle Menu don't open on the point of the mouse in end of the map (top,down, left and right side)
http://prntscr.com/88ht5n

Because of it, not is possible to do the menu in a single click. The angle could be incompatible.

But look it with a double click:

http://www.clonkforge.net/projects/project1473/MagicMenu2.rar
Parent - By Pyrit Date 2015-08-25 18:55
Ah, I understand the problem. Hmm I don't see any good ways to fix that problem. :/
Parent - - By Zapper [de] Date 2015-08-24 21:46
Some time ago (in 2011) I created a magic menu and some spells. I'll just attach the stuff here, use whatever you find useful. I have no idea if it still works :)

PS: I have no idea where the two sounds come from - I don't think I created those
PPS: It's more a CR style combo menu, I guess
Parent - - By vagner [br] Date 2015-08-24 22:43 Edited 2015-08-25 13:06
Are not working, :-(
A lot of errors and warnings.

all graphic.png are corrupted:
Could not load file: C:\OpenClonk\Projetos\teste\Test.ocs\Fire.ocd\Graphics.png
Could not load file: C:\OpenClonk\Projetos\teste\Test.ocs\Fire.ocd\DragonFireEffect.ocd\Graphics.2.png
Could not load file: C:\OpenClonk\Projetos\teste\Test.ocs\Fire.ocd\FireBreath.ocd\Graphics.png
this message for all graphic.png

Can you upload another time? Or the original file are corrupted?

The script is very useful, i will use it to create the magic Energy. Thanks.
Parent - - By Zapper [de] Date 2015-08-25 18:01
Oh, yes, I killed all binary files at some point :(

I looked for it in an old backup and found it and fixed some particles so it works again!

You can load up most spells by either holding the mouse button or holding [down] after selecting the spell!
Attachment: Magic.ocf.zip (993k)
Parent - - By vagner [br] Date 2015-08-25 21:17
Very interesting. I think Sven2 talked about this magic system. But about launch magic, Don't is my magic system menu (Double click) more faster?
And about the openclonk new control system, a menu without keyboard don't is more compatible?

Zapper, can i use your magic staff and some spell from your object to include in my "magic system"?
Parent - By Zapper [de] Date 2015-08-25 21:45

>Zapper, can i use your magic staff and some spell from your object to include in my "magic system"?


Yes, you can use everything you want.
But I did not create the two sounds and the graphics of the two test spells and I don't know where those came from.

> And about the openclonk new control system, a menu without keyboard don't is more compatible?


I think a CR style combo system is very fast if you have a lot of spells. In my system, every spell has two or three activation modi depending on how you use it:
The force field creates a wall on click. It creates a short piece of force field below you when tapping [down] and when holding [down] to full charge, it creates a circle around you.

And most of the spells interact with each other: when you shoot an ice ball with a lightning, it turns into an ice sword!
My plan was to have a slightly slower magic system (where you charge spells) but allow for a lot of different combos with different spells.

PS: I did not test your magic system yet, so I don't know how it feels :)

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