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Up Topic Development / Developer's Corner / TODOs until end of January
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- - By Newton [de] Date 2012-01-08 22:04 Edited 2012-01-24 11:49
The goal is to have something playable (as a tech demo) until the FOSDEM at the beginning of February so that interested open source enthusiasts can try out the game via repository checkout or the new dev snapshots.

Here is the TODO, ? means we don't know yet if it will be done by that person. Specifically, I know that I am not the best candidate to design a flyer, perhaps there is someone else in the community who would like to do that?

+ create OpenClonk flyer for the FOSDEM Newton?
(+ make ready for debian-licensing) Newton

+ polish menus Newton, Maikel
  + production menus: show needed material
  + production menus: show/manage production queues
  + production menus: create graphics
  + drag & drop bugs, handling bugs
  + closing button (or similar) for the construction menu.  Newton?
  + enable meshes being displayed in messages Clonk-Karl

+ create elevator
  + create graphics: model, texture Mimmo, Newton
  + create cabin graphics: model, texture Mimmo
  + script elevator Clonkonaut
 
+ fix Crash with Find_Action, priority high, need this for the elevator!   Isilkor
+ fix backpack-bug (on closing backpack with mouse, clonk throws) Sven2?
+ limit earth-storage for digging out earth chunks to max. half a chunk PeterW?

+ make loam being able to be produced in the foundry (earth+water) Maikel

+ polish Goldmine.ocs Maikel
+ adapt the tutorials to the new contents handling (chest in this case)
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Parent - By Maikel Date 2012-01-09 14:51
We missed adapting the tutorials to the new contents handling (chest in this case).
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Parent - By Clonkonaut [ie] Date 2012-01-10 04:04 Edited 2012-01-10 16:33
Crash with Find_Action, priority high, need this for the elevator!
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Parent - - By Clonkonaut [ie] Date 2012-01-11 03:09
Elevator is done, except proper multiplayer testing (meaning two or more people trying to use it simultaneously and stuff). Just a quick notice to everyone: Library_ElevatorControl is to be included in every vehicle that should be snatched into the elevator case (just the lorry for now because our other vehicles are too big, I guess).
This will also forward the controls for up and down to the case, so you don't have to regrab (although with the new hotkeys this would be more easy, it's still better if unnecessary).
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Parent - - By Newton [de] Date 2012-01-11 13:22
hmpf, forward control to elevator... I was hoping to solve this more elegantly than in CR with the new controls. One press on [space] should suffice btw to re-grab to elevator.
Regarding the snatching to elevator case - what was that good for in CR btw?
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Parent - - By Clonkonaut [ie] Date 2012-01-11 14:45

>  I was hoping to solve this more elegantly than in CR with the new controls.


I really thought this was more elegantly - from the gameplay aspect.

> Regarding the snatching to elevator case - what was that good for in CR btw?


Easier handling to get a lorry in the case. It's stopped and rotated and positioned so no vertices are stuck below the floor.
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Parent - - By Newton [de] Date 2012-01-11 14:50

>so no vertices are stuck below the floor.


We could (also) make the solid mask of the case thicker
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Parent - - By Clonkonaut [ie] Date 2012-01-11 15:35
But it will never prevent the stucking. Unless maybe, you make like 20 pixels solid mask so with no possible rotation one vertex of the lorry gets underneath.
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Parent - - By Newton [de] Date 2012-01-11 17:01
hm... arch, that all wouldn't be an issue with a polygon landscape... ;-)

But still, I was suggesting to also make the solid mask thicker because of clonks that try to scale on it. I remember getting stuck in the elevator ground quite often ^^
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Parent - By Clonkonaut [ie] Date 2012-01-11 17:16
Yeah, that's quite a problem. I copied the old dimensions, meaning 24x26, 2 pixels of solid mask, leaving with 24x24 for the inner case. You can carefully play around between clonks get stuck, clonks can scale on the sides and ridiculously big. 3 Pixels might easily be possible, 4 I'd guess are uglily big but I dunno.
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Parent - - By PeterW [gb] Date 2012-01-16 15:00
It might not be a problem with solid polygon objects. You can get stuck in a polygon landscape just as easily as in a pixel one. I would even argue that it's easier because it's easier to introduce sub-pixel gaps. See Soldat and stuff.
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Parent - - By Newton [de] Date 2012-01-16 16:16
small polygons could drop down. (If a chunk reaches a certain size, it becomes affected by gravity)
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Parent - By PeterW [gb] Date 2012-01-16 17:23
How would that help? Even large polygons can have gaps between them that are small enough to cause problems. To the contrary, dropping small polygons would actually almost automatically create such gaps, wouldn't it?
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Parent - - By Günther [de] Date 2012-01-11 22:56
Well, we could tweak the solidmask-code to ignore stuff that has vertices on both sides of the solidmask or something. It's somewhat fragile code, but we thankfully don't have to worry about breaking other usages while making the ones we need work.
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Parent - - By Sven2 [de] Date 2012-01-12 00:16
Lorries can also get stuck in regular landscapes shaped like that; so I'd rather think we could add a vertex mode that ignores collisions on bottom side if a lower vertex is free.

If that ode were set for the Clonk's top vertices, it would also fix Clonks getting stuck in various places, because you'd always fall down if your legs are free.
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Parent - - By Clonkonaut [ie] Date 2012-01-12 01:45
Wouldn't that mean the lorry will fall through the case and down the shaft?
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Parent - - By ST-DDT [de] Date 2012-01-12 19:30 Edited 2012-01-12 19:37
no, because by default the lorrys lowest vertices remains the same in the elevator, so it would not exclude them, it would only glitch through if the lorry is rotated.

But another problem, what happens if there is floor under the lowest vertice? (Case one feet aboce floor) this may cause some mysterious pictures. One part on the elevator and one on the floor

In CR it stuck inside the case and could only be made accessible by driving the case to floor

PS: Mhh, but you are right, sometimes a lorry may be rotated when entering the e case
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Parent - - By Clonkonaut [ie] Date 2012-01-12 19:41 Edited 2012-01-12 19:45

> Mhh, but you are right, sometimes a lorry may be rotated when entering the e case


Yeah, that's is exactly the case we're talking about here. Unrotated lorry which fit perfectly fine into the case are of less interest ;)
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Parent - - By ST-DDT [de] Date 2012-01-12 19:50
i took some time to check every possible case:
1)one or more wheels are below the solidmask->in my opinion this is the case, when the lorry is not in the elevator->falling down the shaft is right
2)the lorry is above the solidmask->the lowest vertice is above the solidmask->it will collide with the solidmask->the lorry remains in the e case.
3)the lowest vertice is inside the solidmask->?
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Parent - By Clonkonaut [ie] Date 2012-01-12 21:33

> in my opinion this is the case, when the lorry is not in the elevator-


Well, that's easy to say but as every experienced well knows there are times where the lorry doesn't behave like you want to. Imagine a tunnel at about middle height of your elevator case. Say the case is just two pixels higher than the tunnel's floor then a lorry might easily slip one of the bottom vertices below the case. Because of the harsh dropdown rule this would result into the lorry falling down the shaft and landing in whatever is down there (water? lava?); even though to the player the majority of the lorry's body was above the case's floor.
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Parent - By PeterW [gb] Date 2012-01-16 15:04
Wouldn't we "just" need a vertex mode that disables collisions on the all vertexes from "within"? It might be slightly tricky with respect to rotations, but this shouldn't be that hard to sort out, should it?
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Parent - By Clonkonaut [ie] Date 2012-01-16 00:50

> + polish menus Newton, Maikel


+ closing button (or similar) for the construction menu.
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Parent - - By Clonkonaut [ie] Date 2012-01-16 01:38
On another note, as we are heading towards a FOSDEM show-off, two more things: the line kit has an ugly graphic and the idol is still in GoldRush. People will waste money on this (still ugly) thing finding out it does nothing.
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Parent - - By Zapper [de] Date 2012-01-16 07:34

>out it does nothing.


It decorates your base :(
It just has to be less ugly!
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Parent - - By Clonkonaut [ie] Date 2012-01-16 08:48
Decoration's fine if that was a sandbox scenario and money wasn't your goal.
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Parent - - By Zapper [de] Date 2012-01-16 09:26
When I created the statue money wasn't your goal. Getting rid of the gold was!
Maybe you should be able to sell the statue then?

Or change the goal to build 10 statues..! That's more fun than just getting X gold anyway ;)
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Parent - - By AlteredARMOR [ua] Date 2012-01-16 11:31
IIRC we were strongly against mission goals like "Build XX similar buildings".

Building 1 statue is OK because you can explain the user why it is needed to be done. But building 10 statues seems a bit illogical.
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Parent - - By Zapper [de] Date 2012-01-16 12:58
Yepp, with the same reasoning why we were against "collect XX similar ressource" or "make XX money by mining gold"

>But building 10 statues seems a bit illogical


Heh, the Gods command! http://designer-daily.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/07/easter-island-statues.png
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Parent - By Clonkonaut [ie] Date 2012-01-16 14:41
At least the concept 'acquire infinite money' is a one everyone understands. But our idol-days are bygone too long a time to get real sympathy for that :P
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Parent - - By PeterW [gb] Date 2012-01-16 14:55 Edited 2012-01-16 14:57
To be fair - it's strictly more interesting than "mine all gold / ore", in that it requires you to do more. As I remarked on the OCM: We could easily have a script that determines how much gold there is in the landscape, then generates the appropriate "build X statues" goal. I'd find that a lot more elegant than trying to solve pixel-hunting.

The main problem is probably that building is (was?) cumbersome. The goal clearly shouldn't involve spending the last few minutes just watching your Clonks swinging their hammers. Maybe one could make it slightly more interesting by spicing it up by, say, having a few pedestrals in the landscape that you have to build the statues on in order to fulfil the goal?
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Parent - - By boni [at] Date 2012-01-16 15:54
How about getting better equipment depending on how many statues have already been built? Like, after the first one you get plans to build a Flint. When only 5 ore left, you get plans to built an ULTRAFLINT or something. Something that motivates the player to build as many statues asap, while not beeing necessary or stupid.

Note: As you probably noticed, I prefer "Build X" over "Get X Gold". Also "Get X Gold" requires you to have a base where you can buy/sell stuff.
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Parent - - By PeterW [gb] Date 2012-01-16 17:26
Hm, sounds good. Here's a problem though: We would need to make sure that whatever resource we use doesn't "disappear" into other production paths. So if we make it a goal to make ore statues, it might be fatal to melt (too much?) of it. Applies most to Gold, of course: How to make sure the player doesn't just sell it?

Maybe we should introduce crystal just for the purpose of being a no-other-purpose ore ;)
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Parent - - By Zapper [de] Date 2012-01-16 17:40

>Maybe we should introduce crystal just for the purpose of being a no-other-purpose ore ;)


Well, I do have a ~working magic system lying around..!
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Parent - - By Matthias [de] Date 2012-01-16 17:46
Well I still hate mana >:/
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Parent - By Zapper [de] Date 2012-01-16 18:13 Edited 2012-01-16 18:19
There is no mana :]

PS: not 100% decided yet, though
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Parent - By Newton [de] Date 2012-01-16 17:52
Finish and release it! :-D
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Parent - By boni [at] Date 2012-01-17 16:13

> Applies most to Gold, of course: How to make sure the player doesn't just sell it?


That's why I said

> Also "Get X Gold" requires you to have a base where you can buy/sell stuff.


Giving plans for gold statues means you don't HAVE to include a base-thingie where you can sell/buy stuff. Therefore the player can't sell it. :D
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Parent - - By Clonkonaut [ie] Date 2012-01-19 15:05

> + fix backpack-bug (on closing backpack with mouse, clonk throws) Sven2?


Done.
And Maikel did this:

> + make loam being able to be produced in the foundry (earth+water) Maikel

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Parent - - By Newton [de] Date 2012-01-19 17:26

>+ polish Goldmine.ocs Maikel


Maikel is gone for the next week, perhaps you could do this as well?
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Parent - - By Clonkonaut [ie] Date 2012-01-19 17:28
I've already begun with sorting out unnecessary player knowledge. Anything in particular you have in mind?
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Parent - By Newton [de] Date 2012-01-19 19:47
Nothing particular, it was just mentioned in the meeting. Personally, I think we shouldn't waste too much time on that prototype scenario - it will be replaced with proper settling scenarios/campaign (with proper landscape to explore, difficulty, story and goal...) sometime later anyway.
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Parent - By Maikel Date 2012-01-19 17:39
I am actually away for this and the next week, but I already implemented the get X gold goal, which doesn't oblige you to mine all gold.
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Parent - - By Clonkonaut [ie] Date 2012-01-19 16:18

>   + production menus: show needed material


Done.
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Parent - By Newton [de] Date 2012-01-19 17:23
Cool, will have a look at it
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Parent - By Newton [de] Date 2012-01-19 17:23
Mimmo, don't you have the model ready? I would like to texture it.
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Parent - - By Clonkonaut [ie] Date 2012-01-21 20:03
Roughly one week left. It's bothering me that the elevator is in such an unfinished state. I haven't seen Mimmo since you asked for him. I know did some work on it though permanent absence won't help us.
Maybe someone else is willing to finish the model? Matthias?
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Parent - - By Newton [de] Date 2012-01-21 20:34
Well the problem is that he posted it nowhere - we don't have the model.
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Parent - - By Clonkonaut [ie] Date 2012-01-21 20:55
We have this, haven't we?
http://forum.openclonk.org/topic_show.pl?pid=8324#pid8324
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Parent - - By Newton [de] Date 2012-01-21 23:58
It's the old model, he made some changes to it
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Parent - By Clonkonaut [ie] Date 2012-01-22 00:37
That why I said:

> I know did some work on it


The old model is better than no model?
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