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Up Topic General / General / Player Strength in Lobby
- - By Carli [de] Date 2010-02-27 10:13
For some network games, it could be helpfull to know how good a player is.
So it would be an advantage for the hosts team management to know how good a player is.
You could for example show a score like in the league.
Parent - - By Zapper [de] Date 2010-02-27 12:07
Then you should play a league game. Since that is _exactly_ what the league does
Parent - - By Carli [de] Date 2010-02-27 13:41
i even thaught about working a bit on the league code but my last effort to include a unregi-access-patch into the main branch was very deprimizing so i don't even think more about working on OC the next weeks.
Parent - By Clonk-Karl [de] Date 2010-02-27 21:44
Just because your patch was not committed within 12 or so hours does not mean it never will. It's pretty normal in (Open Source) software development that patches may lay around for some time until people review or push them. This is also one thing that decentral version control simplifies. Please also note that reviewing a patch does take time even if it is just a one line change. It not only needs to be tested (it's not enough that you tested it (not saying you shouldn't!) since it is the responsibility of the one pushing the patch that it does not break anything) but it also needs to be checked that it makes sense in a general and technical point of view.

Probably needless to say, but your patch not being pushed is not an excuse to act like a moron in the chat.
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Parent - - By Asmageddon [pl] Date 2010-02-27 20:09
Forget league. I think we need to design it over from beggining. If at all. But "player strength" meter sounds to me like quite good idea.
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Parent - - By Zapper [de] Date 2010-02-27 21:42

>But "player strength" meter sounds to me like quite good idea.


Well, and that can only be implemented using some kind of "league" system. However you would like to call it. A "league" server that stores the points of the players and evaluates the game. Like the current league server. Only the way the points are calculated could (and has to) be changed
Parent - - By Asmageddon [pl] Date 2010-02-28 00:21
Well. In fact I think some kind of spider chart would be good:

showing what player is better at, and eventually absolute numbers.
This way it could easily be viewed if player is good at crazy parkours, logical races, peacefull settlements, fiery duels or cruel melees without neccesarily ranking him as a pr0 or as a n00b.
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Parent - By Zapper [de] Date 2010-02-28 12:32
Sure. If you can figure out a way how a league server can evaluate the quality of a player ;)
Parent - By ala [de] Date 2010-02-28 12:42
Wow, I thought so much crappy thoughts about the league system but never came up with something like that.
Awesome. Categorization, activity, settlement skills, speed run skills, wins against strong enemies, playing time, clan activity..... holy crap. It is so informative yet so simple.

Only bad thing: Determining some important facts (like risk in your example) isn't easy at all.
Parent - By B_E [de] Date 2010-02-28 16:06
Players could maximum give a self-description - which makes it unrealistic anyway.
Okay, one could show facts like most played round, most player goal (Melee...), mostly played alone or in a bigger team - these facts can be evaluated quite simply by the league server. But it already more or less does some of this, it just doesn't show it ingame, but in the league frontend.
Parent - - By Carli [de] Date 2010-02-28 21:09
I think the best way of getting a players strength is that the winner of a match can rate if his enemys were good enemys or if it was hard for him to gain the victory.
That would be the most honest way where no one could cheat.
Parent - - By Zapper [de] Date 2010-03-01 17:22

>That would be the most honest way where no one could cheat.


It would? "haha, I am sooo good I always have no difficulties killing my enemies, so I vote for "total loosers"!"
Parent - - By Carli [de] Date 2010-03-01 18:41
Just look like the google pageranking is done:

a website is the more important the more links of important pages point to this site.
you can solve the self-definition via solving the Eigenvalues of a Matrix
Parent - By Zapper [de] Date 2010-03-01 19:52

>a website is the more important the more links of important pages point to this site.


But that was not what you proposed. You proposed that you could rank your enemies. I don't know whether that is a good idea
Parent - - By Atomclonk [de] Date 2010-02-28 22:40
Maybe we could achieve this through the already mentioned categorization of the league. Every scenario needs to be activated for the league by several moderators or at least categorized. Skullbreak-melees, Knights, Magic, Classic, Hazard (and mods), Settlements. Measured in ELO points, as usual (maybe with some tweaks, no extreme loss of points). Those data can be used to create such a chart.
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Parent - - By Carli [de] Date 2010-02-28 22:49
i would go into an other direction that every game is recorded in the league but not every game has such point weight.

for example clonk party could have a weight of 0 points.
other scenarios could be rated for a bigger weight by moderators or community and the skill-points are splitted to the packs the scenario is using.
Parent - By Sven2 [de] Date 2010-03-01 19:46
The idea of "(almost) every game counts" was what we initially wanted the league to be in CR. It's why we have the super-fast "one click authentification" and an open league that has no limits on the scenarios you can play.

Unfortunately, people didn't adopt the practice of playing every normal melee game in league mode. I fear if we force league evaluation on every game, people will stop playing games at all or make new accounts all the time to preserve their league stats.

Also, a moderator system is always a problem because you'd have to find active moderators all the time. Such volunteer time is better put into more interesting things like tournaments. I'd prefer to have a system that works automatically.
Parent - - By PeterW [at] Date 2010-03-02 01:16

> no extreme loss of points


You mean the inactivity penalty?
Parent - - By Atomclonk [de] Date 2010-03-02 17:57
Not this, I mean, You have a game between two high-ranks. Both of 'em have ~ 600 Points. One is loosing 20 Points, the other gains exactly the same amount. That always bugged me.
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Parent - - By PeterW [at] Date 2010-03-02 23:06
Well, it seems perfectly reasonable to me. Maybe you should explain further what part is bugging you.
Parent - Date 2010-03-03 14:44
Up Topic General / General / Player Strength in Lobby

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