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Up Topic General / Feedback and Ideas / Fluff's feedback: Number two.
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Parent - - By Fluff [gb] Date 2012-10-22 18:37
Assuming that the RTF files were only scenario/folder descriptions, they've all been fixed, as has the balloon string. Word is ridiculous. Open file in wordpad. Save. Close wordpad. File size reduced from 30kb to 1 kb.
Attachment: 5065.patch (12k)
Parent - - By Zapper [de] Date 2012-10-22 18:49

>Word is ridiculous. Open file in wordpad. Save. Close wordpad. File size reduced from 30kb to 1 kb.


Knowing Windows, Word probably saves your version, time, real name, address, phone number, facebook friends and everything else in that file
Parent - - By Ringwaul [ca] Date 2012-10-23 18:29

>offtopic time? offtopic time.


This is pretty accurate actually. There was an american serial killer who was caught because of the metadata saved in a Word document.
Reply
Parent - By Fluff [gb] Date 2012-10-23 18:32
So... The moral of the story is: Proper coders and serial killers use wordpad.
Parent - - By Clonk-Karl [de] Date 2012-10-23 20:44
This patch only includes the changes since your previous patch, and it doesn't include the RTF file changes. I suppose you committed the two separately, right? Can you send a bundle of the two? To create that, click on the first patch in TortoiseHG, then right click the second one, then choose "Bundle from here to selected...". This makes sure binary files (the RTF files that Word created are treated as binaries) are included in the patch, and it gets us the changes of both of them.
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Parent - By Fluff [gb] Date 2012-10-23 21:01
I don't see a "Bundle from here to selected". What am I doing wrong?
Parent - - By Fluff [gb] Date 2012-10-23 21:31
Here goes nothing.
Attachment: OpenClonk2_5064_to_5065.hg (36k)
Parent - - By Clonk-Karl [de] Date 2012-10-23 21:42
Thanks, I pushed it into the repository!
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Parent - By Fluff [gb] Date 2012-10-23 21:42
It actually worked? Wooo.
- By Fluff [gb] Date 2012-10-22 19:23
Another suggestion: A display showing how many bulbs of power you are producing, and how many bulbs you currently require.
- - By Fluff [gb] Date 2012-10-22 20:35
And another suggestion:
In settlements, instead of clonks just straight dying at 0hp, they go into a "dying" phase, where there's still a small amount of time to bring them back to some kind of safe-zone where they can recover. This could be disabled in harder rounds, to avoid making food pointless, or possibly food could also be used to extend the time-to-death. Also, they would be revived to a very small amount of health (1?) and still need food for anything beyond that.
Parent - - By Zapper [de] Date 2012-10-22 20:50
What is the idea behind that? To make the impact of a random event (meteor, vulcano, mining accident..) less dangerous while still punishing certain player-caused hazards (drowning, jumping into lava, jumping into the monster cave, ...)?

I am not sure whether I like that. I could imagine that it makes the lives of your Clonks feel less valuable.
Parent - - By Fluff [gb] Date 2012-10-22 21:21

>To make the impact of a random event (meteor, vulcano, mining accident..) less dangerous


Don't understate this. I just lost a clonk in the first 30 seconds of Krakatoa because of a metorite setting a tree on fire setting him on fire.

The recovery could have a high material cost(cotton for bandages, wood for splints, metal for prosthetic joints,etc.), so you're still punished for it, just not quite as badly. I'm not, by the way, saying all those items should be added, those were just examples of why you'd need the materials to help them recover.
Parent - By Matthias [de] Date 2012-10-22 21:39

> Don't understate this. I just lost a clonk in the first 30 seconds of Krakatoa because of a metorite setting a tree on fire setting him on fire.


I was against these kinds of desasters anyways. On further thought, the main problem may lie with the fire, not with the disasters themselves.
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Parent - - By Andriel Date 2012-10-22 21:46
And while you are producing all this stuff the clonk lays on the ground and gets killed by every rock falling on him?
I like the idea of rescueing your favourite clonk in the last second, bringing it to a safe place and help it, but isn't it a lot easier to just get some berries and heal it?
I think it is also a bit illogical: Your clonk just jumped into lava? Don't worry, it didn't die, you can heal it with some produced stuff! Losing your clonk right at the beginning is not nice, but you learned from it. Next time you will probably send your clonks underground immediately. As Zapper said, you have to be careful with your clonks, they are valuable!
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Parent - By Fluff [gb] Date 2012-10-22 22:26

>And while you are producing all this stuff


Unless I already had some wood/cotton/iron laying around, in which case I just need to get that clonk back to safety.

>I think it is also a bit illogical: Your clonk just jumped into lava? Don't worry, it didn't die, you can heal it with some produced stuff!


You could always make them die to fire, so they couldn't survive a lava bath.
Parent - - By Zapper [de] Date 2012-10-23 06:46
As Matthias says: I believe the problem there is more that the fire is still too strong.

In OC the fire is already a lot weaker than in CR. You have to stand for a few seconds in front of a burning object (less if more objects) to reach the state that you don't slowly extinguish yourself.
If that is still happening too easily with single fires, we might want to weaken that further.
Parent - - By Maikel Date 2012-10-23 06:59
Walking around with wood, etc. in your inventory still is pretty much insta kill.
Parent - - By Zapper [de] Date 2012-10-23 07:02
Oh, I honestly didn't think of inventory :o
Will fix that - imo it should be even stronger than in CR: inventory objects never catch fire even if you swim through lava. Just because you don't have a visual feedback if your inventory is on fire. In CR that led to those half-burned bows everywhere where the players had no idea why they could not shoot anymore :)
Parent - - By Ringwaul [ca] Date 2012-10-23 07:55
Would it be possible to make the GUI icons start emitting flames? :o
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Parent - By Zapper [de] Date 2012-10-23 11:15
Right out of your screen into your face? :O
Parent - By Clonkonaut [de] Date 2012-10-23 11:34
Sheesh, I thought it was common knowledge that such things are possible via the keyboard...
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Parent - - By Matthias [de] Date 2012-10-22 21:40

>In settlements


That's an "exception" in the gameplay that might trip us up later - when, exactly, does a settlement scenario stop being a settlement? If it's a "no-goal"-scenario, but players start fighting, does it still count as a settlement? And where does a base melee fit in?
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Parent - - By Fluff [gb] Date 2012-10-22 22:26
Make it a rule?
Parent - - By Matthias [de] Date 2012-10-22 22:28
I don't like to "balance" the game by adding more and more stuff to it.
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Parent - By Ringwaul [ca] Date 2012-10-23 08:01
While I think the idea is neat, I agree with you. Adding more features will probably result in more imbalance, and those new features will then need to be balanced. :/
Reply
- - By Fluff [gb] Date 2012-10-23 18:07
Turning a pump off doesn't stop it from taking power. Meant that I couldn't make a line kit to add to the pump to move water to make space for another windmill :\

Also, closing the irc channel with alt+c disconnects you. I wish it didn't.
Parent - - By Zapper [de] Date 2012-10-23 18:17

>Turning a pump off doesn't stop it from taking power. Meant that I couldn't make a line kit to add to the pump to move water to make space for another windmill :\


That's on the "will-fix-list" right next to "fix elevator" :<
Parent - - By Fluff [gb] Date 2012-10-23 18:19
:) What about being able to set priorities for what gets power first?
Parent - By Zapper [de] Date 2012-10-23 18:44
That is already in place and working :)
A non-transporting elevator should never steal power from a workshop. I just must either have forgotten the pump there or there is a bug somewhere
- - By Fluff [gb] Date 2012-10-24 18:24
Are you supposed to be able to carry 7 loaded guns?
Parent - - By Caesar [de] Date 2012-10-24 18:24
If you can find 7 guns and have the time to load them.. why not?
Parent - - By ala [nl] Date 2012-10-24 18:40
Could be an unbalanced thing - like some players training only that technique and becoming insta-kill sniper.
Parent - - By Maikel Date 2012-10-24 21:24
Well we have to see it first and then we'll do something against, it would look cool however, maybe you can even make a macro for that...
Parent - - By ala [nl] Date 2012-10-24 22:15
From CR experience I know that there are some really primitive guys out there: In mage scenarios there are even players who use only one single spell - but they train this one to a really, really fast and destructive level.
Ingame they use that trick , hit you - and run away if you are fighting back. After some time, they again surprise you with a super fast attack and run away again.

Hm speaking of which, is there a way Open Clonk can prevent Macro use? Fun or not, I always considered it an unfair advantage towards normal players.
Parent - - By Pyrit Date 2012-10-24 22:21
Speaking of spamming, I found myself almost instantly killed by a sword attack. You get hit, your Clonk falls down and you aren't able to do something. And even before your clonk is back up you already get hit again by the sword and fall down again.
Parent - By Fluff [gb] Date 2012-10-24 22:24
That, or the two fighters stand too far apart to hit each other, and just keep swinging and missing, neither of them wanting to move closer to the other.
- - By Fluff [gb] Date 2012-10-24 21:31
Was playing a round of Overcast with Pyrit and Andriel. I chose a gun, because 7guns ftw, and Pyrit chose a bow and spawned next to me. Epoch gunvbow battle ensued. I think the lag screwed him over a bit, because I had a lot more time to see and dodge his arrows than he did my bullets, but here's what stands out: My strategy of picking up his arrows and throwing them at him. The time between "click, throw" is shorter than "click, shoot bow" so I was able to lock him down and damage him without him being able to fight back.

This gave me an idea for a new weapon: Throwing stones. The humble rock is the most basic of weapons. You throw it. That's it. But it's a bit... Outclassed. The firestone works exactly the same, but with the added bonus of exploding. I think good throwing skills are underrated in this game. The ranged weapon tutorial doesn't include a chance to practice your aim with some gooding throwing (javellins don't count, they have their own physics.)

Throwing stones would be smaller than a normal rock, but stackable, allowing for quick volleys of rocks. Like a ninja's shurikens, they aren't designed to kill (although with good aim, the damage would start to add up...) but to hinder and distract. Punish your enemy for bringing a gun or bow to a rock fight. Don't let them reload their weapon. Shoot them with yours while they're tumbling from your hits. I'm currently reading the documentation to see if I can work out how to make this weapon. I guess it's about time I started creating something more than hot air.
Parent - - By Fluff [gb] Date 2012-10-24 21:46
Related: Does OpenClonk have a developer mode?
Parent - - By Caesar [de] Date 2012-10-24 21:48
Of course. Try the search function.
Parent - By Fluff [gb] Date 2012-10-24 21:57
To search what?
Parent - - By Fluff [gb] Date 2012-10-24 22:30
Is this what you mean? If so, maybe there should be a link to it on the development page.
Parent - By Caesar [de] Date 2012-10-25 06:55
That, and that.
Parent - - By Pyrit Date 2012-10-24 21:57
Mh, this might also have to do with my shitty gaming skills. ;)

But I found reloading the bow to be a real problem. When I released the mouse button to shoot, I had to wait for the clonk to finish the shoot animation to reload again. This means I shot the arrow and *quickly* tried to reload it again, by pressing the mouse button again. I thought it would reload, but because the clonk still had to finish the shooting animation, it didn't. So I hold down the mouse button for a few seconds only to realize that didn't do anything. By that time I already got killed.
Same with disruption while loading. I hold the button, the clonk goes into the reload animation. I get hit and the reloading stops. Naturally I don't release the mouse button, because I think it will reload automatically when the tumble animation is done and I'm still holding the button. But no. You have to release the button and press again.

TL;DR
I think the reloading should automatically start again when the button is pushed down.
Parent - - By Zapper [de] Date 2012-10-24 22:26
I plan to implement that in the controls branch (items reacting even when you pressed the button at an inapproriate time)
Parent - By Matthias [de] Date 2012-10-24 22:42
Please do. I remember moaning about something with aiming after tumbling at the OCM.
Reply
Parent - - By Newton [de] Date 2012-10-25 09:08
You'd have to rewrite parts of the control system for that. If you have to, please do it cleanly.
Parent - - By Zapper [de] Date 2012-10-25 09:15
And I believe that doing that in one blow with the changed controls (one hand) would be the right time for that.
Parent - - By Maikel Date 2012-10-25 09:17
Indeed, so keep it on the control branch (or a different one for that matter), since I regard the one hand controls highly experimental.

Also cause the current one is not even completely free of bugs, neither well documented, nor explained fully in the tutorials...
Parent - - By Zapper [de] Date 2012-10-25 09:30

> not even completely free of bugs


Do you have anything special in mind? That would be a good time to fix it, especially if it requires reworking parts of the system.
Up Topic General / Feedback and Ideas / Fluff's feedback: Number two.
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